Subject	There are two (linked) problems with this discussion
Posted by	Technomancer on October 22, 2003 at 3:32 PM
	This message has been viewed 68 times.
In Reply To	fat or thin? the question of contact patches and grip.. posted by genic on October 22, 2003 at 09:46 AM
Message	ZEngineer has pointed out one of them: wide tires have an advantage with more available contact patch in a turn. (He didn't mention that this results from the stiffness of the tire rubber working against the narrow tire.) This is half the issue. The other half is that frictional force is NOT just a coefficient times the compression force (normal force) as they teach you in physics 101. Rubber is elastic and so does not behave like the little wooden blocks where F=u*N. At some point, the rubber begins to disintegrate. That happens when the shear (force/area) becomes too great. From ZEngineer you know that wider tires have more contact area available to them. Now you know that that extra area allows the tire to provide more friction before it crumbles into little rubber marbles. I thought about this stuff for a long time but never got around to writing it up. I quit physics before I had the time. (Physicists never have any extra time...) - John
Follow Ups	fat or thin? the question of contact patches and grip.. - genic 09:46:31 10/22/03 thanx for the cliff's notes. (n/m) - Sportzcoop 09:51:17 10/22/03 read it all....good to know (n/m) - genic 09:52:29 10/22/03 Re: read it all....good to know - Sportzcoop 09:55:46 10/22/03 btw, for the lazy. Link to image... - Sportzcoop 09:59:26 10/22/03 wide + dry = good, wide + wet = bad (n/m) - naZeer (Houston) 10:00:59 10/22/03 Didn't know you were a Brit :) (n/m) - BigTDogg (MA) 10:01:22 10/22/03 Great writeup! VTF! One quick note: - therinL 10:01:46 10/22/03 i didnt write it...look at the link at the very top (n/m) - genic 10:04:28 10/22/03 I know you didnt write it...I still think its FAQ-grade (n/m) - therinL 10:07:08 10/22/03 It begs to ask a question though... - Marshall 12:28:17 10/22/03 Try that in the rain @ 60 mph. - FantasyZ 13:43:10 10/22/03 lol, who races their Z, Viper, etc. in the rain? - Marshall 17:29:17 10/22/03 screw that noise...its easier to slid around the corners (n/m) - genic 17:31:04 10/22/03 yeah, and into a tree. (n/m) - Marshall 18:13:09 10/22/03 I see one blatant omission: - ZEngineer 10:26:02 10/22/03 That's a good point. - Marshall 12:43:31 10/22/03 Yep, I was just about to post a link to this =) (n/m) - therinL 13:45:30 10/22/03 I've got a question... - Funky 10:34:41 10/22/03 Re: I've got a question... - therinL 10:54:05 10/22/03 Lol, That brings up a funny story...I think I'll share... - AbnormallyAspirated 11:50:32 10/22/03 I tend to think that overall diameter plays a role here too. - 1991TT 15:14:45 10/22/03 Stiffness of the tire rubber will provide a diameter effect - Technomancer 15:40:34 10/22/03 There are two (linked) problems with this discussion - Technomancer 15:32:55 10/22/03 Very good info, here's the rebuttal I've heard: - SooperZ95 17:37:10 10/22/03 Both you guys are right, but - NytWolf 18:44:05 10/22/03
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